PAROLE HEARING

Wednesday, June 11, 2003

BOBBY
BEAUSOLEIL

SUBSEQUENT PAROLE CONSIDERATION HEARING
STATE OF CALIFORNIA
BOARD OF PAROLE HEARINGS

In the matter of the Life Term Parole Consideration Hearing of:
ROBERT BEAUSOLEIL
CDC Number: B-28302

INTERSTATE REGION I HEADQUARTERS
SACRAMENTO, CALIFORNIA
JUNE 11, 2003

PANEL PRESENT:
BOOKER WELCH, Presiding Commissioner
ROBERT HARMON, Deputy Commissioner

OTHERS PRESENT:
ROBERT BEAUSOLEIL, Inmate
CAROLYN HAGIN, Attorney for Inmate
PATRICK DIXON, Deputy District Attorney
DANA KERNAN, Observer
EVELYN BIRCH, Observer
JADE LEON, Observer

PROCEEDINGS

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Testing, testing.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Is it Beausoleil?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: My last name is Beausoleil.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Beausoleil. Okay. So what I'm going to do, Mr. Beausoleil, is read your case factors in the record. That's the first thing I'm going to do. Okay.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: All right. Sir, before you move on, I can barely hear you. Is there a way to -- Is there a way that that can be corrected at all?

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: We're talking in the -- This is what picks up. I don't believe so.

MS. KERNAN: You don't think?

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Maybe so.

MS. KERNAN: All right. It can't hurt.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: This is just for the recording. Can you hear me now?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: It's about the same.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Can you turn this up? Does this have an adjustment on it?

MS. KERNAN: I don't believe so.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. Are you on speakerphone or a handheld phone? Mr. Beausoleil?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes, Sir.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Are you on a speakerphone or a handheld phone?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I'm on a handheld telephone. Just not a very good quality phone, I'm afraid.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Can you hear us now?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I can't hear you very well. You're fading in and out.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. What I'm going to do, I'm going to put you on hold, and I'm going to call the technician back and ask her to redial this up and see if we can get a better line. Okay?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Okay. Thank you.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: All right.

MS. KERNAN: Okay.

[Off the record]

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Mr. Beausoleil, we're going to read your case factors into the record.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: May I ask a couple of questions first?

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: What are the questions?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Well, first of all, I would like to know -- May I ask first who I'm speaking -- who's speaking with me.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: If you give me a minute, we're going to introduce ourselves. Okay?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Okay.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: All right. But you're speaking to Commissioner --

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: The other question -- I have one other question, is --

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: -- Commissioner Welch.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: -- what will you be reading from as you read the case factors?

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: From a BPT Form 100.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Okay.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Why don't you listen for a few minutes, and then I'll give you an opportunity to ask questions. Okay?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Certainly.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: The prisoner's name is Beausoleil, that's B-E-A-U-S-O-L-E-I-L. First name is Robert, R-O-B-E-R-T. CDC number is B-28302. The date of the hearing is 6/11/02 [sic]. The location where the Panel is located is Region I Headquarters, and that's in Sacramento, California. The prisoner was received CDC on 6/23/1970 from Los Angeles for the offense of murder first, Case number A057452, count one. Total term -- Count one. Penal Code violated 187. Total term, seven years to life. Minimum eligible parole date was 8/04/1976. Now, sir, this hearing will be tape-recorded today. So for the purpose of voice identification, we'll go around the room and identify ourselves, stating our full name and spelling our last name. In your case, when your turn comes, we'd like for you to add your CDC number. Now I will start with myself. My name is Booker Welch. It's spelled W-E-L-C-H. And I'm a Commissioner with the Board of Prison Terms. Go ahead.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Robert Harmon, H-A-R-M-O-N, Deputy Commissioner.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I didn't hear the last name, Sir.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Harmon, H-A-R-M-O-N.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I'm sorry. You're fading in and out again.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Harmon, H-A-R-M-O-N.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Okay. Thank you very much.

ATTORNEY HAGIN: Carolyn Hagin. Hello Bobby.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Hello.

ATTORNEY HAGIN: H-A-G-I-N.

DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEY DIXON: Patrick Dixon, D-I-X-O-N, Deputy District Attorney, Los Angeles County.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Ms. Hagin, you're the attorney representing the prisoner.

ATTORNEY HAGIN: I am the attorney representing Robert Beausoleil.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: And this will be my turn?

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: No, not yet.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Okay.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Go ahead.

MS. KERNAN: Dana Kernan, K-E-R-N-A-N, Case Records supervisor with the SACCO unit, observer.

MS. BIRCH: Evelyn Birch, B-I-R-C-H, SACCO, observer.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Thank you. Okay. It's your turn, sir.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Robert Beausoleil, B-E-A-U-S-O-L-E-I-L. My CDC number is B-28302.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Thank you, sir. Before we get started, I need to talk to you a little bit about the American Disabilities Act. Are you familiar with that law?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Somewhat, yes.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. Let me just go over it a little bit with you. The American Disabilities law is a law to help people with disabilities. Disabilities are problems that make it harder for some people to see, hear, breathe, talk, walk, learn, think, work, or take care of themselves than others. What's important to you, sir, is that no one can be kept out of a public place or activity because of a disability. If you have a disability, you have the right to ask for help to get ready for your Board of Prison Terms hearing. And that includes to get to the hearing, to talk, to read forms and papers, and understand the hearing process. The Board of Prison Terms will look at what you ask for to make sure it falls under the American Disabilities Act, and that you have asked for the right kind of help. If you do not get the help or if you don't think that you got the kind of help that you need, ask for a grievance form. You're entitled to get a BPT Form 1074. That's a grievance form. And you can also get help to fill out that form if you need to. Does that kind of clear it up?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes, Sir.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. Now, do you have a disability that's defined under the American Disabilities Act?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: No.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. Counselor, do you have any concerns about your client's rights as they relate to the American Disabilities law?

ATTORNEY HAGIN: I do not.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Well, apparently you didn't fill out a BPT Form 1073. And that's a declaration that you fill out declaring that you do or you do not have disabilities as defined under the American Disabilities Act.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I did sign the form related to disabilities. It did state that I don't have any disabilities. I'm not sure what happened as far as it getting to you.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Well, I don't seem to have it in your file. Anyway, Commissioner, do you have the prisoner's reading level?

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: No. He's received his GED. He's taken a number of college courses and successfully completed them.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Sir, do you know what your TAB score is?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: My what score?

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Your reading level. Your grade level.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I'm at college reading level.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. So it's over a 12 point?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Do you have any problems -- Are you currently assigned to any mental health program?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: No, I'm not.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. Counselor, do you have any concerns?

ATTORNEY HAGIN: No.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. We'll proceed with the hearing. Sir, the purpose of today's hearing is to once again to review your suitability for parole. We will review the number and the nature of the crimes you were committed for, your prior criminality, your social history, and your behavior and programming since your commitment. We've had an opportunity to look at your C-File and your prior transcripts, and you'll have an opportunity to make corrections or clarifications, along with your attorney, to the record if you deem it necessary to do so. Can you hear me okay?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I'm still having trouble. But I'll muddle through here.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Well, I want you to be able to hear.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I know. It's just I can't believe that in 2003 we can't do better than this. You know. I don't mean to sound like I'm whining, Mr. Welch, but, you know, I haven't had an opportunity to speak with the Board in three years, and I really value this opportunity. And I'm going to do the best I can. Can you hear me okay?

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: I can hear you just fine, sir.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Okay. I'll do the best that I can to hear you. It's difficult because you're fading in and out. I wish I could design your system for you, frankly.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Well, that's not possible. But can you hear me okay now?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I can -- Well, I can hear you as good as I could hear you before. It's -- Like I said, it fades in and out, and I'll do the best I can.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. Well, if there's something that you need us to repeat, please feel free to do so.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Okay.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Now do you use a hearing aid, or you have any hearing deficiencies?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: No, not at all. I have good hearing.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: It's all the equipment?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. We will consider your progress since your last hearing, any new psychiatric reports, or any other information that may have a bearing on your suitability for parole. Any change in parole plans should be brought to our attention. Before we recess for deliberations, the District Attorney, your attorney, and yourself will be given the opportunity to make a final statement regarding your suitability for parole and the length of confinement. After that's done, we'll recess, clear the room, and deliberate. Once we reach a decision, we'll reconvene, and at that time, we'll let you know what our decision is. Do you understand all that so far?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Now the Board of Prison Term rules and the law state that a parole date shall be denied you if in the opinion of the Parole -- Commissioners, the Panel members, your parole would pose an unreasonable risk of danger to others. However, prisoners do have certain rights. Counselor, have your client's rights been met?

ATTORNEY HAGIN: Yes.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Sir, you have an additional right. You have a right to a fair and impartial Panel. Do you have any reason to believe that the Panel members would not be fair and impartial to you?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: No.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: You will receive a copy of our written tentative decision. That decision becomes effective in 120 days. What's important for you to remember about that is you have 90 days from the date that you receive a copy of the transcript to file an appeal should you deem it necessary to do so. Do you understand that?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Now you're not required to admit to guilt today. You're not required to talk about the crime. However, the Panel members accept as true the findings of the court. Do you understand that concept?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes, I do.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. Commissioner, is there any confidential information being used today?

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: No.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Counselor, here's a list of the documents we will be working from today. Would you check to see if you have those documents.

ATTORNEY HAGIN: Yes, I have all of these documents.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Counselor, do you have -- would you check -- I mean District Attorney, would you check to see if you have them.

DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEY DIXON: Yes, I have them. Thank you.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Thank you. Counselor, do you have any additional documents to submit to the Panel today?

ATTORNEY HAGIN: I do. I have a few documents. The first are additional exhibits, letters of support received from four individuals. I have an original here that's hole punched at the top, and I also have multiple copies.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Just give me copies. You may want to hold on to your originals.

ATTORNEY HAGIN: Okay. Well, I have submitted originals with the -- Theirs is a copy there.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay.

ATTORNEY HAGIN: Would the -- Would Commissioner Harmon like a copy.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Thank you.

ATTORNEY HAGIN: And here's another copy for the District Attorney.

DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEY DIXON: Thank you.

ATTORNEY HAGIN: As I said, these are four additional letters of support that were received after I submitted the parole brief. The other item I would like to submit are -- is one photograph taken approximately three months ago of Mr. Beausoleil with his wife. I'll provide one to the District Attorney.

DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEY DIXON: (Inaudible).

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Thank you.

ATTORNEY HAGIN: One to each Commissioner. And I do have here three videos that are available for your review. I'll mention a couple of the names of them. One is Life in a World Behind Bars, the Story Told by Prisoners; another is a video documentary of the Oregon State Penitentiary, Past and Present. These were both produced, directed, scripted by -- were all done so by Mr. Beausoleil.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. You mentioned a brief that you submitted.

ATTORNEY HAGIN: I have submitted a parole brief, as well as -- And that was on the checklist. It has been received. A parole brief which contains approximately 20 exhibits, which are letters of support, as well as what I've termed a statement of facts, which is -- which are the commitment case factors we deem relevant and hope will be incorporated in this hearing today. So those two items have already been submitted.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay.

ATTORNEY HAGIN: I believe that I don't have anything additional.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. Thank you. Do you have any preliminary objections?

ATTORNEY HAGIN: Well, it depends. I may have -- As I said, I'm hopeful that the Board will incorporate the statement of facts that I had submitted, which is based on trial transcripts, previous hearing transcripts, psychological evaluations, Board Reports. I hope that the Board will incorporate that. That is my only preliminary objection as far as -- At the last hearing, a Statement of Facts from 1983 was incorporated, and we would object to the incorporation again of that Statement of Facts, because it does seem to be somewhat inaccurate.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. District Attorney?

DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEY DIXON: I have a problem with that. I -- Counsel was nice enough to allow me to look at the statement of facts. I don't have a copy of it. There are no citations. I don't know where those facts are coming from, whether they're trial transcripts, prior Board Reports, or just hearsay. It seems to me in my limited experience with the Board of Prison Terms in earlier years, the idea is that at the initial hearing or hearings the facts of the life crime are established so that it's at a point closer in time to the actual crime than now and more reliable than now. I just don't have any idea where those facts come from, and I have a difficult time. I would have a difficult time with the Board relying on those facts.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. Anything else, Counselor?

ATTORNEY HAGIN: No. Just -- I did want to just point out that at the last hearing, it seemed that even those facts -- over the years, they've been somewhat confused. And that was the motivation behind preparing this statement of facts. As I said, it is -- You know, I can be sworn under oath that it is based on trial transcripts. There's nothing that is new to the record. It's -- The hope is that in order to move on from -- So that, you know, we can really get into what Mr. Beausoleil has accomplished and the strides that he has made while he's in, the hope is that we just clarify the record for some of the things that appear to be inaccurate. If the Board is not willing to accept that statement, I would, at the very least, ask that you incorporate the statement from the last hearing, because I think at the last hearing Mr. Beausoleil was able to clarify a couple of issues for the Board.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. Thank you, Counselor. Thank you for all the work that you've put into your version. However, as I told you earlier, and I told your client, the Board accepts as true the findings of the court. And what we use is either -- For the Statement of Facts, we either take the Statement of Facts from an Appellate Decision or the Probationary Report, and then we use the Board Report. And the Board Report should take their facts from one of those two sources. So that's what we use as the Statement of Facts. Okay. But let's just take a short recess.

ATTORNEY HAGIN: Thank you.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Will your client be speaking to us today?

ATTORNEY HAGIN: Yes.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. Before we take a recess, sir, I know I can't see you, but would you raise your right hand.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes, Sir.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Do you solemnly swear or affirm that the testimony you give today will be the whole truth and nothing but the truth?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes, I do.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. We're going to take a short recess. I'm going to put you on hold. Don't go anyplace. It's only going to be about three minutes. Okay?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: That's fine.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: All right.

[Off the record]

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay, Counselor, I had to make sure that we had your legal brief, and we do, and I've read it.

ATTORNEY HAGIN: Okay. Are you there, Bobby?

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Hello? Did you take him off hold? Hello?

ATTORNEY HAGIN: Hello?

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Hello?

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: He must have hung up again. Must have lost him.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Hello?

MS. KERNAN: Want me to press redial?

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Hello?

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: I'm going to go off record.

[Off the record]

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. Can you hear us better now?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I seem to be able to hear you better now.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. Did you hang up on us or what?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: No, that was (indiscernible) hanging up. And then I kind of lost you a little bit. But I think so far so good.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. All right. So we're going to -- I'm going to take the Statement of Facts from the --

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Before you go there, --

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: No, I'm going there, and then --

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Okay.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: -- we can talk about it. Okay. We're going to take that from the Probationary Report, and then we'll be able to talk about it. I'm just going to read it into the record. Under Present Offense, "Defendant was arrested on August 6th, 1969, in San Luis Obispo, transported back to this jurisdiction and booked on suspicion of murder. The data of probation and sentence hearing, he will have approximately 270 days in custody." I don't need all that. So we'll go down to the third paragraph. "It appears that the victim Gary Hinman, H-I-N-M-A-N, was found dead at his home on July 31st, 1969. He had last been seen alive on July 25th, 1969, driving a Fiat, that's F-I-A-T, station wagon. The cause of death to the victim was described as a stab wound in the heart. Several non-facial cuts were also found on his body. At the time of his arrest, the prisoner -- the defendant was driving a Fiat station wagon that belonged to the victim. When questioned by the arresting officers, the defendant first stated that he had bought the car from the victim for 200 dollars, but later stated that the victim had given him the car." And that's the Statement of Facts from the Probationary Report.

ATTORNEY HAGIN: Can I ask the date of that report.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: You've got a copy of it in your packet there, but it's 10/29/1980 is the date that's date stamped on there. And it's found under the legal documents, and it's the Superior Court of California for the County of Los Angeles Probationary Officer's Report. Okay, sir, is that an accurate Statement of Facts?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: That -- And first of all, I want to thank you, Mr. Welch, for going back and doing that. It is accurate as far as those particular aspects of what happened, and I have no problem with what you read into the record.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. Did you commit this crime?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes, I did.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: And why did you commit the crime?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I killed Gary because he had said that he was going to go to the police, and I wanted to avoid that. I wanted to avoid arrest. That is essentially why I committed the crime. I'd like to, you know, expand on that, of course. There's a lot that I want to say about this. And --

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Well, go ahead. This is your time.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Thank you very much. I hope that you will consider what my attorney has submitted for your review as the statement of facts. It does include everything that has happened insofar as my involvement, what led up to it, my involvement with other people, with the codefendants, and what their involvement was. It is to the best of my knowledge and to the best of my memory entirely accurate. I don't know -- You know, I don't think that you want me to read this into the record, but certainly I wouldn't have any objection to it if it was read into the record and added to the Statement of Facts that you just presented. But the main thing that I want to be able to say to you is what led up to it insofar as what I now understand about why I did what I did, and how I was thinking, what I was thinking, what led to the offense. I want an opportunity to tell you what I've learned from the experience, what has changed.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Well, why don't you go ahead and start telling us.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Well, --

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Start with why you committed the crime.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I committed the crime because I -- as I said, I was trying to avoid being involved with law enforcement over a drug deal and the assault on Gary Hinman. I did not assault him. This was something that was done by Charles Manson with Bruce Davis. An assault had occurred, and I was left with the problem, so to speak, by those two individuals. They left and told me to clean up the mess. And I tried over, you know, a full day with Gary to talk him into being okay, you know. He was hurt. He had a slash on his face from the wound that Charles had inflicted on him.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Were you referring to Charles Manson?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes, Sir. The events -- Let me backtrack a little bit. Are you going to -- Let me ask you. Are you going to read the statement of facts or have you read the statement of facts that my attorney has presented?

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Yeah, I've read what your attorney presented. I -- And we can call -- I read her version of the statement of facts.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Okay. How much of this do you want to go over? You know, I want to be able to talk to you about things that are going to help you to understand what has happened with me since, in the past 35 years. But I have to make sure that we're all talking about the same events and the same circumstances that, you know, related to the crime. I need to feel that you are understanding what I'm talking about. Do I need to go into the details in regards to the drug deal initially with the Straight Satans motorcycle club?

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Yes, go ahead and tell us about that.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Okay.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: You can give us the short version, but go ahead.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Okay. Well, it was a couple of days before Gary was killed. And I -- First of all, I've got to say that, you know, a lot of the confusion that we've had over the Statement of Facts in this hearing and the previous hearings is really my own fault. I have to take ownership for what has happened. I didn't own up to what I had done when I was arrested. I didn't own up to my trial. So really I don't have anybody else to blame but myself for the confusion over what has happened and some of the kind of bizarre versions that have been made up, particularly those that have been based on the statements of Dan DeCarlo. Danny DeCarlo was a participant in the events that led to Gary Hinman's death. He made deals to get out of it. So I'm asking you to try to, in you mind, mitigate some of the statements that he had made, which the earlier statements and facts were based on entirely. He was a member of the Straight Satans motorcycle club, and at that time I was, you know, I was looking up to these guys. I kind of -- I was kind of romanticized that their lifestyle was something that I liked. I kind of thought they were cool. I was young, and these guys were 10-15 years older than me. And I wanted to impress them, and they were going to have a party at Venice Beach. I wanted them to invite me. I wanted to go along on the party. They said that they wanted to -- It was a 10-year anniversary party for the, you know, for their 10-year motorcycle club anniversary, or something like that. And they wanted to score something different, some psychedelics for their party. And I thought that I might be able to impress them to, you know, to kind of get in with them if I were to set up a deal for them. I knew someone in Topanga Canyon who made mescaline out of peyote cactus buds. That was Gary Hinman. I'd known Gary for a couple of years, and I saw an opportunity to sort of ingratiate myself in these -- with these people. So I set up a deal. It was 1,000 tabs or capsules of home made mescaline for 1,000 dollars. The next day, the (indiscernible) came back to Spawn Ranch and essentially he kind of beat me up. You know. They hit me in the stomach and, you know, pushed me around and held a knife up to my throat and said they wanted the money back because I had sold them bunk. They said that they had gotten sick on the drugs, and they wanted their money back. So I told them I would do everything I could to get the money back. I was driven over to Gary's house. A gun was put in my hand. Bruce Davis gave me his gun, and they told me, okay, if he doesn't cooperate, you should hit him and make sure he gives you the money back. So I went into Gary's house and confronted Gary and told Gary I wanted him to give me the money back, that the bike club was making threats, and that I needed him to give me back the money. He said that he had spent it. He showed me his -- I didn't believe him. I did what the guys had told me that I should do in that case, and I hit him with the gun a couple of times. And he insisted that he didn't have the money. He showed me his checkbook, and at that point, I believed that he didn't have the money. There were -- The two girls had come along for the ride on this thing, and they were with me at the time. And I laugh at this, because I'm so embarrassed at some of the things that I did. And one of the things that I did that I'm embarrassed about is that I gave the gun to one of the girls and told her to hold it on Gary so that he wouldn't move while I went and looked around his house for something that might be worth 1,000 dollars. So I left the room. They were in the kitchen, and I left the room and was looking around in the living room. There was only -- This was a real small house. There was only two rooms in the house. It was an old wooden house on a hill in Topanga. Anyway, I heard yelling coming from the kitchen, and it was the girl that I'd given the gun to yelling, Bobby, he's got the gun. He'd taken the gun away from the girl. And I went back into the kitchen and sort of, you know, just dove at him, because I was trying to keep him from turning the gun on me. And it wound up that both of had our hands on the gun, and we were kind of wrestling over it. We fought over the gun. Not any blows or anything. We just kind of wrestled. And I assume from what I've been able to pick up subsequently that what happened while this was happening, while we were fighting over the gun, is that one of the two young women called the Spawn Ranch and apparently communicated to someone there that Gary had taken the gun away from me. After we had struggled with the gun for a minute or two, the gun went off, and, you know, no one was hit, but it was loud, and we were both sort of stunned by the sound, and it caused us to kind of freeze for a moment because, you know, both of us thought we were shot. I managed to, in that moment, to get the gun back from Gary. And after that -- You know, after we kind of both calmed down, Gary and I were both trying to -- You know, we were both ashamed at that point of what had happened. And we just (inaudible) ridiculous thing to have been involved in. And Gary offered to sign over his -- He had a couple of old cars, and he offered to sign those over to -- as something that I could then take to the bike club that might be worth 1,000 dollars. Between the two old cars, I figured that was something that they might accept, in particular the VW bus. So -- It was a little VW, you know, VW van. So he signed over the two pink slips to me, and it was about that point that I was ready to leave and Charles Manson and Bruce Davis showed up at the front door. And, you know, Gary knew these guys. He knew Charlie. Everybody in, you know, around Topanga Canyon knew each other. Gary had known Charlie for a couple of years. And he went to answer the door. And apparently Charlie, who I think was told that Gary had taken the gun and that his girls were in trouble -- When Gary answered the door, I guess Charlie just assumed that he still had the gun, and he just walked in, and before he found out that Gary didn't have the gun, that there was no longer any problem, he slashed Gary across the face with this kind of a long knife. It looked like a sword, but it was really a long knife. He slashed him across the face. It cut him on his cheek. It cut his ear, and, you know, kind of made a nick in his ear. And then everything just kind of stopped. I mean I wasn't -- nobody was -- nobody there, except for possibly Manson was prepared for what happened. And Gary, you know, said, why did you do that. I said, why did you do that. He said -- He turned to me and said he was trying to show me how to be a man. And Bruce Davis asked me -- asked Gary for the gun, and Gary told him that he didn't have the gun, that Bobby had it. And so Bruce turned to me and said, where's the gun. I gave him the gun. And he was -- I remember that he was annoyed because the gun had been jammed. And then Charlie and Bruce left. Charlie said something to me. I don't really remember a lot of this clearly, because I was pretty shocked by what had happened and decided -- I suddenly felt completely out of my element, and it's something that I was --

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. Then what did you do?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Then I spent the next day with Gary, all the next day. That was kind of late at night by the time Charlie and Bruce had left. And I'd spent the whole day with Gary, and I doctored his wound. I sewed -- used some dental floss to sew the nick in his ear. I couldn't do much about the --

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: When did you -- Why did you decide -- When did you decide to kill him?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: That evening, Gary said that -- he was insisting that he wanted to go to the hospital. Then I told him, you know, if you go to the hospital, they're going to bring the police in. He said, I don't care. And I -- At that point, I panicked, and I killed him. I stabbed him once, and he didn't fall immediately. So I stabbed him again, and he died then.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. Anything else you want to tell me about the crime?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: That's pretty much it. I tried to cover up my tracks. I tried to make it look like it was some of the people that Gary had been involved in. He was -- Like a lot of us, we were all into -- At that time, it's 1969, and there was a lot of polarity in our country, and people our age were into a lot of things that, you know, I'm certain a lot of us now regret. Gary was into sort of militant activities at the college, at UCLA. So I tried to make it look like it was some of his friends.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. And I was going to ask you about the militants and the -- at UCLA, but you've already covered that. And I noted that in your counselor's brief that was submitted.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. So you've had an opportunity to basically cover most of the things that your counselor submitted --

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes, Sir.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: -- in her brief. And we will consider that as your version of the crime. Okay?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Thank you very much.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: All right. Let's go to your criminal history. I see an arrest in San Francisco for a Health and Safety violation to include a possession of hypodermic needle.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Mr. Welch, before we go there, I mean I'm certainly willing to ask that -- answer anything related to that. But I -- Can I tell you a little bit about -- Now that I've been able to communicate to you about what happened from what I know that happened, can I tell you a little bit about what I now think about that?

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. Tell me if you have any remorse for the crime that you committed?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I have deeply regretted what I've done, to hurt Gary, to hurt everyone in his life, everyone in my life. I must say that I was an extremely selfish individual, that the motivation in the first place in getting involved with the bikers was to promote myself. That was selfish. I went against my better judgment in that I'd never done any drug deals or anything like that prior to that.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Well, tell me about the things that have changed about you. What have changed about you?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: What has changed is that I am far more aware of my tendency to be selfish, to be self-centered. And that was -- That is what allowed me to desensitize myself enough to take Gary Hinman's life. It's that I was so wrapped up in my needs and my need to escape from the situation that I was in, that I was able to desensitize myself to the needs of everyone else, and in particular, Gary, and to have desensitized myself enough to have taken his life.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Since then, I have --

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: And what would preclude you from doing something like this again?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: My awareness that everything that I do affects other people. When I finally -- And it took me a number of years with a lot of help from a lot of people to become aware of the tendency as a person who is an artist, for example, you know, I've come to understand that people who are -- who have my sort of personality profile do tend to be somewhat egocentric, and it's not necessarily a bad thing unless it becomes a habit of not considering the feelings and the needs of other people. So my habits now are -- And it is a habit. I had to -- Because it is not something that maybe is -- comes as naturally to me as other people, I have made it a habit to always put myself in the position of the other person, to always consider what the consequences will be, which is something that I didn't do at the time.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. I think I understand your point. Okay. Now let's move on to your prior criminality. I see you were arrested on 11/13/66, and that was in San Francisco, and it was basically a Health and Safety violation, possession of drug syringe and restricted dangerous drugs, and that was dismissed, dismissed, and dismissed. I guess that was all dismissed. Is that correct?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes, Sir. I might be able to help you understand what was going on if I just tell you that at the time this is 1969. I was a hippie, you know, for all intents and purposes. I mean I can barely (inaudible) that, but I was longhaired, wore funny clothes. I was a musician, and I attracted situations where -- that put me in some, you know, either suspicion or some sort of minor confrontation with law enforcement on occasion. Sometimes I was in the wrong place at the wrong time where (inaudible) one case, the hypodermic syringe, for example, was in the back pocket of somebody who was in an apartment that was raided at time where I was at that apartment. So those kinds of situations or circumstances that led to arrest that were, of course, then, you know, never went -- that never went to arraignment. They were dropped in every case, say for one.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. Well, let me go over the rest of them.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Okay.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: And you had another one, San Francisco, on 1/15/67. You were arrested for possession of marijuana, and there's no disposition on that. Then there's another arrest in Redwood City, auto theft, traffic violation, and that was attorney in the interest of justice. So I guess that was dismissed in the interest of justice.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: And then you have one in Berkeley for a Health and Safety violation. There was no complaint filed. Then in Los Angeles on 2/15/69, there was a 211, robbery felony. There was no disposition on that. And then in Los Angeles, there was a burglary, detained only. And that was on 3/09/69, insufficient evidence, and San Luis Obispo on 8/06/69, grand theft auto.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: That was for this offense.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: I understand that. Let me finish. And you were turned over to the Los Angeles Sheriff's Department, and then you went to Los Angeles, and they booked you on 187 for murder, and you were convicted of murder. Is that correct?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: That's correct.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: And you were sentenced to death. Is that correct?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes, I was.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: And your term was overturned, and you was sentenced to life. Is there any other criminal history that I may have missed?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Well, there was one conviction that you didn't mention, and that was a misdemeanor, failure to appear for a ticket for walking my dog without a leash. That's -- But that was my only conviction.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Yeah, I saw that in your -- in the record. Okay. Is that it?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: That's it.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. Let's go to your social factors. Where were you born?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I was born in Santa Barbara, California.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Both parents in the home during your formative years?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes, Sir.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Would you say you had a pretty stable home environment?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: More or less. My father had to work two jobs. You know. I didn't have a bad childhood. I -- You know, it was a middleclass family. Catholic. I had two brothers and two sisters in a house that wasn't really big enough to contain all of them. So I made a move for myself out in the garage. And I would say that I had a middle of the road sort of -- You know, we had our, you know, some dysfunctions in our family. But by and large, they were a good family, and I had a good upbringing.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Well, do you still have contact with your family members?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Both of my parents -- My mother just died last December.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: I'm sorry to hear that.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: My father had died some years previously. I have excellent relationships with my two brothers and my two sisters.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Any of them have problems with law enforcement agencies?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Pardon me?

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Any of your relatives have problems -- your brothers and sisters had problems with law enforcement agencies?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: No. No, they didn't.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. Very good. So you still have contact with them.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. That's very good. What's the highest level of education you completed prior to coming to prison?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I completed the SAT college entrance exams. I got pretty good scores on that. I got completions in a couple of different vocational programs. I didn't go really any higher in college. I challenged courses that I was interested in because I wanted to gain the credits for those particular areas of -- you know, usually in media or things that I was interested in.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: So the 12th grade is the highest level you completed?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes, Sir.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. And you took the SAT, but you never went to college. Is that it?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: That's correct.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. I got it. Did you use any illegal drugs prior to coming to prison?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes, I did.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: What kind of drugs did you use?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I used marijuana primarily. I experimented with LSD and, you know, peyote and some things like that. I did not involve myself with, you know, barbiturates or heroin or, you know, amphetamines or methadrine [phonetic] or anything like that. It was (inaudible). I was a hippie. I smoked pot by and large.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. How often did you drink?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Pardon me?

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: How often did you drink prior to coming to --

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I didn't drink.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. Were you married prior to coming to prison?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: No, I wasn't.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Do you have any children prior to coming to prison?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes, I had one out of wedlock child. Her name is Jeanne Beausoleil. She's written a letter for this hearing.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: You still have contact with her I take it.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes, I do.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Have a good relationship with her?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Pardon me?

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Do you have a good relationship with her?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes, I -- Well, you know, she didn't really come into my life until she was 17 years old, and she is, of course, 35. She -- You know, she was born after -- soon after my arrest. And we have, you know, a friendship. It's not like a father/daughter relationship so much as it is a friendship. And -- But she is very intelligent, and I'm very proud of what she's done with her life.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. Tell me about your employment history prior to coming to prison.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Primarily, as a musician. I was a member of Musicians Local Six. I did a lot of studio work and performance work in San Francisco and in Los Angeles. I commuted frequently between those two locations. I also played other areas along the coast, but in California, but primarily in San Francisco, the Bay area and in Los Angeles. Prior to that, I had done a little bit as a teenager. I had worked for a trailer company, building trailers as a carpenter. I had worked for my -- You know, again, in growing up, I worked for my grandfather (inaudible) concrete products every summer since I was 12, until the time I left home at about 16.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: You ever serve in any branch of the military?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: No.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. I'd like for you to give your attention to my colleague. He's going to talk to you about your post-conviction factors.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Mr. Beausoleil, can you hear me?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes, I can.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Okay. Listen carefully. We're going to just take parts of the record here. We want to make sure that they're accurate. It does show that you were transferred to the Oregon State Penitentiary, May of 1994.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Okay. Your counselor writes a report for this hearing that I'll touch bases on. A lot of it is repetitive. In the area of post-conviction factors, the counselor writes here -- I was looking for your counselor's name. Anderson, A-N-D-E-R-S-O-N. And it says here in the area of work, it says, "Inmate Beausoleil has been assigned as an audio/video technician with the Oregon State Penitentiary TV Productions Program for the past seven years. He produces videos for inmate orientation, skill development, and transition programs for the youth outreach programs, and for staff training. Currently assigned as an audio/video technician in the activities sections." Then your vocational, it says, "Inmate Beausoleil is not involved in a vocational program at this time. However, he continues to upgrade at the skills of his profession in his current work assignment. He is currently producing work at a level well in advance of any vocational program available in corrections setting." That's part of what your counselor wrote here. Your file in California reflects that you completed the vocational electronic program back in 1985, and the vocational productions course in '84 -- video productions course in '84. I noted that you also started, but never completed, the vocational graphic art and offset print program in '93.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Actually, there was supposed to have been a completion chrono on that, but I was transferred just prior. But I did have the hours in, and that was supposed to have been a completion for the graphic arts only portion of the program.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Okay. I don't --

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I understand that there's no chrono there, and that this is just me talking to you.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Okay. So basically your skills in the production area would be something you'd carry to the outside. Is that right?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: That is true, yes.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Okay. You've held various jobs besides the years as a tech. You've worked as a clerk technician, teacher's assistant, some of the other responsibilities that you've handled as well. Is that right?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes, Sir.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Received your GED in 1978. Your college -- I was having some trouble there. How many units of college have you actually completed?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I think -- If I'm not mistaken, I think it's 21 units.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Okay.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: And those are mostly from challenges in specific courses.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Okay.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I have one of those was from the University of California in Stanislaus.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Okay. Now you indicate that -- Well, let's go with ones that your file corroborates here. You took a 16-week course in individual psychotherapy at one point back in California.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: I also noted that you took some other psychotherapy for a few weeks with another intern prior to that. You took an advanced relaxation for a week program back in '85. You indicate that you completed the Breaking Barriers, Creative Dynamics, and Violence Prevention Youth Outreach to the doctor. I haven't been able to corroborate that. Do you have the years on those completions?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: No, I don't. They don't do the same thing here in Oregon that they do in California. They don't really give you a completion. Actually, I've got a certificate kind of thing that is sort of like a diploma kind of thing. But there's no -- They don't do a specific -- They don't have a chrono system here.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Well, was that done in Oregon?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes, it was.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Okay. That's why I don't have it in your C-File here then. Okay.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I might want to just -- If I could interject a little bit, in the programs, particularly the Breaking -- Are you familiar with the Breaking Barriers program?

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Yes. California has it, right.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yeah. That's what I was thinking. Gordon Graham has -- he and I have -- He's -- There's a letter from Gordon Graham in my -- the packet that's been given to you. It's one of the letters of support. He -- I starting working with him back in 1995, it might have been '96. I recreated the entire Breaking Barriers video series, 17 sessions, plus some additional -- This was after I took the course myself, by the way. So I'm intimately familiar with the precepts that are involved in the Breaking Barriers program, as well as the Building a Trust Account Supplement program, the introductory video programs for him as well. I've done a great deal of video work for the Gordon Graham Company, and I had probably benefited more from actually having to watch the same material over and over as I'm editing, spending, you know, a week or two on each session. I've learned a great deal, and I apply the principles from that program daily. It's an extremely valuable program in my opinion. And so anyway, I do have a lot of intimacy with that particular series of programs with Gordon Graham Company.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Okay. Thank you. Are you participating now in AA?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes, I am.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: And have you been following the program steadily, the 12-step program?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I meet with everybody. I meet with the group once a week. It meets on Saturday. There's some times I have to work because there's, you know, some pressure to get some job done. But I would say 90 percent of the time I'm there every week.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Do you know the 12 steps?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I -- Yes, I do.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: How are you dealing with the eighth step?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: The eighth step. This is making amends, making a list of the people that I've harmed in my life. I have done that eighth step. I repeat it often to remind myself. But I have made that list, and I have made amends to everyone whenever possible, both directly and indirectly.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: The victim in this particular case, what have you done there?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I wrote to the Hinman family. I expressed my deep regret over what I had done. I explained to them some of the events that led up to it. I -- Primarily because of what was put in the newspaper was so horrendous, so off the mark, I wanted them to know from me what had actually happened. And --

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Do you know if they received it?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes, they did. I never received a reply, but I didn't really expect that I would.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Did you use the District Attorney's office in LA as an intermediary or did you write to them directly?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I managed to get it to them directly.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Okay. Is there any other self-help group programs that I've missed here, or have we covered them?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I think that we have covered the ones -- The ones that were mentioned in the counselor's report are the ones that I have been involved in. But, you know, self-help, I mean that covers a lot of territory when you say the word self-help. Formal groups are not really the only way, maybe not even the best way to benefit from self-help. And I think one of the most beneficial ways that I found has been in working with youth, because I have found myself in these young kids who were making the same mistakes that I was making when I was their age, and seeing that and being able to work with them and helping them to work through their own thinking has helped me more than I think any other single program has.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Let me ask you this, Mr. Beausoleil. You know, as we go into this, and we're talking 12 step and that, --

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: -- you had a dirty urine in '99.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes. (Inaudible).

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: And you had THC. You had the same thing back in '88.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: What's going to be different down the road?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Well, it's already different. The incident in '99 was a real wakeup call for me. And once again, you know, that's that tendency to be selfish. It's something that I really have to monitor. And that was a situation that reminded me that I -- that it is just something I do once and it's okay from then on. It's something that I really have to form a habit to be conscious about how things affected other people. In that particular instance, it didn't just affect me, you know. Prior to that, my attitude about pot was that, you know, it's not really addicting. It's not that big of a deal. You know. No harm, no foul. And, you know, I kind of made it an exception, you know. And I haven't made any other exceptions as far as doing anything illegal or getting involved in any sort of activities that are, you know, against the rules or whatever. But that was one where I did make an exception.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Why wasn't the '88 incident a wakeup call?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: The what?

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Why wasn't the '88 incident a wakeup call?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Because it didn't affect people. I didn't see that it affected other people in the same way at that time. This time it did. This time my wife was unable to visit with me in a normal fashion for a year. I -- It hurt the trust that I had built with the people that I work with, with Gordon Graham and Company. It got in the way of work that I'd been doing with them. And it violated their trust, and it made me realize that I can't screw around. I mean I just can't do it. It's not worth that much. I mean, you know, doing, you know, over three decades in prison, I kind of rationalized to myself, you know, hey, let's be nice and just kind of, you know, relax and smoke a little pot and just kind of relax for an evening. But I can't do that. I mean if you're going to trust me, you have to know that I'm not going to do that.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Okay.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: If my family is going to trust me to not come back to prison, then I've got to not do that. And so I've made that very firm commitment. It was a wakeup call, and that's not something that will ever happen again.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Okay. The record also reflects that in California, you had five 128s. The last one was April 4th of 1990, and that was a behavior problem.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I don't recall that one, Sir.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: I'm sorry. What?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I don't recall the incident.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: You don't -- What is it -- What did you say, Mr. Beausoleil?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I said that it was 1990, and the 128, the chrono, I'm not -- I don't know what the incident was.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Okay. It was a documented counseling. Now understand something, Mr. Beausoleil. When we go over this, we don't have the officer to testify today. So I don't need a long dissertation.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Right.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Okay. But apparently you were in the corridor. You had MAC business you said. And you went to the B-wing at about 5:30 in the evening, and then went to their central recreation yard. And apparently you fell out of place with your eating privileges. Does that ring a bell?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Vaguely, yes. I was probably in an area that the officer believed that I shouldn't have been in. And --

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: You had two of those about five days apart.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Okay.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Same thing, basically. You dealt with MAC business.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: That's Men's Advisory Counsel.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Right. And then with the -- And then in Oregon, what I see here is '96, you had several. One was for smoking, one was for disobedience, one was for being in an unauthorized area, and then prior to that in '95, disobedience. These are things that were pointed out in your counselor's report. So --

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Now the disobedience, those are -- Actually there were two incidents. And the disobedience was always -- There were actually two incidents.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Yeah. I understand some, sir. We can't retry the case or whatever it was, because I don't have anybody to ask other questions of. So I'm just saying things that the counselor pointed out. And apparently, they made good cause findings on them, because they wrote them up.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Right.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: You know. So -- But that's what I've been able to uncover at this point. So '99 was your last disciplinary. Is that correct?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Pardon me?

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Ninety-nine was your last disciplinary?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Okay. Your counselor -- Going back to your counselor's report, now it says here, "Inmate Beausoleil was transferred to the Oregon State Penitentiary in May of '94. In the years since then, he has consistently maintained a positive work ethic in his assignment. The documentation indicates that the services he has provided have been beneficial and highly regarded. Letters of recommendation from ODOC staff, including the director of corrections, laud Beausoleil for his craftsmanship and professional manner. His personal nature and consistent efforts have helped him to develop a substantial basic community and family support to aid him in his transition when he is paroled. Inmate Beausoleil has availed himself of many of the institutions programs in his desire to be a better person. His behavior reflects a mature attitude. He has remained disciplinary-free during this evaluation period." That's covering part of your counselor's report, and it's a positive report. What I'm going to do is I'm going to move on to the doctor's report.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Okay.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: And what we have to do is, we have to go back to February 8th of 2000, a report that was completed by Colistro, C-O-L-I-S-T-R-O, consulting psychologist. Apparently the date at the time was February 18th of 2000, the date of the report. And the interview was on the eighth. Anyway, the doctor talks about a lot of repetitive issues, other areas. I'm going to go directly to the area of mental status. And he talks about the day of the interview. It says, --

[Thereupon, the tape was changed.]

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Okay. Mr. Beausoleil, can you hear me again?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes, Sir, I can.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Okay. I'm going to go back here. We're going to go to the area of mental status. Counselor writes -- I mean the doctor writes, "Subject is alert and cooperative today, displaying no behavioral indications of mental or emotional disturbance. As indicated above, he discusses his sentencing offense with no apparent denial or minimization. His statements reflect self-awareness, self-critical thinking, victim empathy, and an understanding of the steps he needs to take upon return to society to protect himself against reversion to a criminal lifestyle. Test results (inaudible) MMPI-II testing again revealed a valid profile with no significant elevations on the clinical scales. Analysis of subscales likewise is unremarkable, indicating no underlying anger, negative attitude toward authority, or other personality characteristics that reasonably could be expected to predispose him to behave aggressively." In conclusion, the doctor writes, "The 52 year old has been incarcerated since 1970, upon conviction of murder. The offense having been an outgrowth of countercultural lifestyle he was pursuing which involved use of illicit drugs and association with criminal elements in society. Results of current psychological testing are consistent with observed and reported behavior and indicating this individual has utilized the resources of this and other institutions in a successful fashion. As a result, he has developed impressively in the area of self-awareness, self-control, concern for others, and personal responsibility. Results of today's exam were consistent with other findings in recent years, and indicating that the maladaptive personality characteristics which predispose subject to the commission of the sentencing offense are now in remission. He does, therefore, pose no substantial threat to the safety and welfare of the community as long as he continues to pursue a productive lifestyle and maintain total abstinence from any psychoactive substances." Under Diagnosis, Axis I, No Mental or Emotional Disturbance, History of Polysubstance Dependence and Abuse in Remission, Axis II, No Personality Disorder, Antisocial Personality Features. And that's signed by the doctor. And that's part of his report. The prior report from '97 was from Jerome Gordon, G-O-R-D-O-N, a consulting psychologist. And the doctor at the time wrote, in part, "His MMPI-II was valid, and there were no significant elevations on the clinical scales. On the supplementary scales, there was an indication that if he did use drugs or alcohol, he would be likely to abuse them. There are also indications of a rebellious attitude and a dislike for other people having authority over him. The (indiscernible) was both valid and interpretively useful. He is under situational stress, which tends to reduce the effectiveness of his functioning and makes him quite susceptible to impulsiveness and vulnerable to disorganization. He has less psychological resources available than do most people and thus is more susceptible to stress. He tends to view the world in a narrow or simplified manner, which while momentarily psychologically economical, creates a potential for behaviors that disregard social expectations. He tends to be less concerned with issues of social acceptability than are most people, which leads to many behaviors that are idiosyncratic. He prefers to think things through before initiating behavior. When not under stress, he seems to control his emotions reasonably well. He is cautious about interpersonal relationships and does not usually anticipate being close to others. He seems to be reasonably interested in people and works hard to create and maintain relationships with them." Under Diagnostic Impressions, Axis I, No Diagnosis, Axis II, Antisocial Features. And under Conclusions, the doctor writes in part here, "Inmate Beausoleil has made significant progress during his incarceration and has a positive attitude, as well as a positive lifestyle in prison. He can be described as quite independent in his thinking as well as preferring to do things his own way and without supervision. He is less concerned than most people with issues of social acceptability, but is more cognizant of the effect of his actions on others than he is earlier in life -- than he was earlier in life." The doctor goes on here and at the conclusion, "His current potential for violence is less than that of individuals convicted of similar crimes, and his adjustment to parole is likely to be better than that of individuals convicted of similar crimes. He would have more difficulty handling stressful situations than would most people in the general population." And that's signed by Dr. Gordon. So what I've done, Mr. Beausoleil, is I've taken parts of a couple doctor's reports, the most recent counselor's report, and areas of your institutional adjustment. Now I may have inadvertently left out areas that are very important to you. Before I move on to your parole plans, is there anything you wish to add?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I think you've covered everything pretty well. I really do. I can't think of anything outstanding that you've, you know, -- anything outstanding that you missed. I think you covered it very well. Thank you.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Okay. Thank you. Counselor, did you have something you wanted to say?

ATTORNEY HAGIN: One minor addition I wanted to point out. Dr. Gordon prepared a supplemental report, which is called addendum, dated five months later on 9/17/97, and that's also in the Board materials. And I just wanted to point out that in the new report, Dr. Gordon modified Mr. Beausoleil's potential for violence from -- initially he says less than most individuals convicted of similar crimes, and he modifies that, and he says notably less. So I did want to point that out.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Thank you, Counselor.

ATTORNEY HAGIN: Uh-hmm.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: And I'll return to the Chair.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. Mr. Beausoleil, we're going to talk about your parole plans. In case you receive a parole date, where you do plan to live?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I plan to live with my wife at our home. We have a home in Oregon, about 10 minutes away from here, outside of the town of Salem.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: How do you plan to support yourself?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I plan to support myself. I do have alternative residence, or at least, you know, the potential for alternative residence, both with my brother who lives in Oregon and with my stepson who lives in Los Angeles, should I be required to return to the county of commitment. So there are alternatives. But my intention, my plan, my hope is to parole, as I said, to my home with my wife in Oregon.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: And let's talk about how you plan to support yourself.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Initially, I would take a job. There is a new job offer, which I am not, you know, -- I'm just going to say this to you because I don't have anything written very recent. There is a company in Oregon called Gold Com who says that they would be very interested in using my abilities in multimedia in their company. But my long-range intention -- I say initially. I, you know, I've got to be honest with you. I've been in prison for 35 years, and no matter how much I may have been diligent in keeping up on technology and --

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Why don't you tell me about your job offers.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Pardon me?

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Tell me about your job offers.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I have a job offer in Los Angeles, should I need one in the commitment county, with Sony Pictures.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Very good.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: And that would be for sound design and music direction.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: I saw that in your attorney's packet she submitted. Anything else?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: And I have a job offer with my brother if he -- if I need one with him. There is employment both at the company Sonic Foundry, located in Michigan, and who I can do work for remotely in -- from Salem.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I have -- or in hopes that I will be able to continue to provide them with work. I've been doing that from here, in part with my job here. And that -- the same applies with M-Audio, which is a very large music technology company located in Los Angeles in Compton. They would be willing to accept my services either on site or remotely. There are letters from those persons, from Mike Huckler from M-Audio and from Steve Provari (phonetic) at Sonic Foundry. My intention would be to take a job initially, you know, a job that'll help me to get my feet on the ground, because it's going to be a little bit like Rip Van Winkle, and I'm going to need that -- I've got to be honest with myself, and although I have a really strong support base with my family and friends, it's going to -- there's going to be some work involved in the transition. So my intention is to take a job initially, get my feet on the ground. But my long-range plans are to work from my home studio in my home office, or whatever you want to call it. I would call it a studio. And telecommute and do work for clients as I've been doing from here. I mean it's just -- It's perfectly consistent with what I've been doing from here, which is to do work (indiscernible) the clients in many cases such as the Gordon Graham Company, for example, where I don't really have to be -- I can be in another state and still do that kind of work. So that is my long-range plan.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. Thank you, sir. You do have a lot of letters. You have a lot of support letters in this packet that your attorney submitted, and they're all very supportive. And I did see a few job offers in there. So let me just say right off the bat that you have a lot of support letters, and I won't be able to read them all into the record. However, you do have one here from Jean Beausoleil.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Pardon me? From whom?

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Jeanne Beausoleil.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Okay. That's Jeanne.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Jeanne Beausoleil.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: That's my daughter, yes.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: She wrote you a very supportive letter, and she says, "I'm happy to announce that I'm currently pregnant with my first child, and my father's first grandchild. But I often wonder whether or not my child will have the opportunity to know his or her living grandfather." And she's imploring the Board to give you a parole date, and she writes you a very supportive letter. And also there's another letter in here from Richard Cupp, C-U-P-P, writes you a very supportive letter. He says that he met your daughter, Jeanne -- Jeanne, excuse me, in 1995. They got married in a simple ceremony. And he's writing you a very supportive letter also. So that's your son-in-law. And there's another letter from Steven P. Beausoleil.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes, that's my brother.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: He writes you a very supportive letter, and he refers to you as his brother. And he says, "Our family believes his time will come to be paroled, and we would not write this if we did not support him or feel that he is very prepared. He would be extremely grateful if -- We would be extremely grateful if he would give this to Robert, give him a chance for parole, as well as his many family and friends." So you have a supportive letter there. Cynthia Dayton, D-A-Y-T-O-N, writes you a very supportive letter. She's an attorney out of New York in the Legal Affairs Department of Social Services. I guess she litigates guardianship hearings for at risk adults. Basically, she writes you a very supportive letter. Do you have any other comments on her?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Well, she is -- she was actually going to represent me initially for this hearing. This was before we found out that in order to do so, she would have to have been a member of the California Bar. And at that point, Ms. Hagin came in on this case. And --

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Well, she writes you a -- She articulates a lot of your case factors and your accomplishments since you've been in prison. And she writes you a very supportive letter.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: And I have a letter here from Barbara, same last name as yours, Beausoleil. She's your wife. She writes you a very supportive letter. She says you met -- that the two of you met over 20 years ago, and that you were already an accomplished musician and artist. Have any of your work been published, musical or artistic work?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes. My musical work, actually, have been getting -- This is work that I did prior to my arrest, and also some that I've been permitted to do on occasions since my arrest. And I'm actually -- It's become more popular in recent years than it was initially for some reason, and I guess an interest in the 60s and that sort of thing has something to do with it.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Are you receiving any royalties?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: It's actually helped us to -- The royalties from that have actually helped us to be able to afford getting this place here in Salem.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. And she says that you express deep remorse for having taken the life of the victim. And she says that over 20-plus years, you've been married, that you transformed yourself into a person that can be counted on for trust and love rather than fear, and you've come a long ways from the frightful 21-year-old who entered prison 32 years ago. Then she says in the last paragraph, "Two years ago, we purchased this property in Salem, Oregon. We have a wonderful home and have also built a two-story studio on our property where Bobby will be able to continue his work in electronics and sound design, as well as other audio and video projects. It would be a priceless gift to be able to spend my remaining years living with Bobby in our home and working in our studio together. He has so much to give, and I want him to be able to give it." And that's from your wife Barbara. Very supportive letter. I have another supportive letter here from Raymond T. Austin. Mr. Austin was the activity manager at Oregon State Penitentiary, and he talks about your accomplishments since you've been in prison.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yeah, Mr. Austin is my supervisor.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Well, he gives you a very supportive letter. And there's also another letter here from Randy Geer, who was also an activity manager before he promoted. And one thing I found in his letter was interesting. He says, "My experience with Bobby is that he's somehow able to move through the prison culture without it touching him. I understand that the cloud that hangs over Bobby because of his pre-incarceration associates him with Charles Manson." And he says that he cannot address that issue. But he can address the issue of you since you've been in prison, the issues that he addressed. And he talks about your accomplishments in the audio field. And you have another letter in here from Nancy -- I believe it's Nancy Lee Lang. Is that correct?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: LaPage.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: How do you spell it? L-E-P --

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: L-A-P-A-G-E.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. A-G-E. Michael Huckler, H-U-C-K-L-E-R, writes you a very supportive letter. Says you've become a valuable resource for us in new production testing (indiscernible) testing drive, and provides us with feedback on product performance and new product development. "I can definitely say that Bobby is both skilled and employable, and I look forward to working with Bobby should his release be granted." And this is from -- I'm assuming this is a job offer.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes, it is. That's from M-Audio, (indiscernible) M-Audio.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: (Indiscernible).

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: (Inaudible).

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: And I have another one here from Gordon Graham.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes, Sir.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: And this is from Gordon Graham Corporation. And it says, "We have produced several different video-based programs on cognate skills, training, utilizing OSP video capabilities." Says that you've been the lead person, lead inmate resource in all of these productions. And Mr. Graham is -- Where's Mr. Graham out of? Out of Washington, is that --

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes, he's from Bellevue, Washington.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. Do you have any more -- Oh, you have another letter in here from your stepson, Eban Freeman?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Evan, yes, Evan Freeman.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: He writes you a very supportive letter. And I did also see a letter in here from Sony.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Jim Freeman writes you a supportive letter.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yeah, John Freeman. That's my other stepson.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Renee Arnandes also writes you a supportive letter.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: She's my sister.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Daniel and Claudia Beausoleil.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: My brother and sister-in-law.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: They write you a supportive letter.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: They are also offering, you know, as usual, alternative residence and employment if necessary.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Yes. "Robert Beausoleil is my brother and my wife's brother-in-law. Every time his parole hearing comes up, we offer Robert employment and housing on our 17-acre farm in Williams, Oregon. Own and operates excavation business. My wife owns and operates a meditation service."

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yeah, mediation.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Mediation services in Grants Pass, Oregon. We have lived there -- "We've lived here for over 25 years." So you have a job offer there. Is that correct?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: And you have quite a few other support letters in here. I was looking for the one from Sony.

ATTORNEY HAGIN: That's Exhibit 14.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Is that from Don Murphy?

ATTORNEY HAGIN: That's correct.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. That's the one I'm looking for. It says, "I am a motion picture producer based on Sony Pictures -- based at Sony Pictures in Los Angeles. Not only is this something that I completely support, but I also have gone so far as to offer Bobby a job should he desire one at the time of his release." So he writes you a very supportive letter. And he talks about your musical expertise. It's unique.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: That would be the capacity that they would want to use my services.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: And what would you do? What would you be doing?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I would do the sound design for motion pictures, sound effects design, musical themes, and musical -- what we discussed as musical direction where I would take music from various places and combine it to create an overall, you know, musical presentation for a film. Just by the way, this -- the company -- Don Murphy recently finished producing a film that's -- you're just now going to be seeing the trailers for, called The League of Extraordinary Gentlemen with Sean Connery. It's, you know, a major motion picture that's coming out. And Don has communicated to me that this the sort of project that he would involve me on, because I'm particularly good at designing unique sound effects and sound moves.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. Did I cover all of your job offers?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Except for the one from Steve Provari, from Provari, although we didn't discuss this, he has also indicated -- I believe that's Exhibit 13.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. Why don't you go ahead and tell me about it while I look for it.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: This is from Sony Foundry from Steve Povari, who is the promotions and artists relations manager at the company, and he -- it says that he has been using my services -- the companies been using my services for (indiscernible) on their video editing applications, on their sound editing applications, and that he's appreciated the skills and knowledge I bring to it, and that he looks forward to working with me.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. I do have it here. And you pretty much gave a good summary of it. Okay. It says, "In summary, Mr. Beausoleil's skill, knowledge, demeanor, and already established credentials would assure him success in the media production industry."

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: In the paragraph above it, it says, "Should there be (inaudible), we would rely on Mr. Beausoleil's expertise in an expanded consulting or training capacity. We've relied on his professional recommendations (inaudible) development over the past four years."

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Very good. It certainly does. Is there anything else?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I think that's pretty much it. I mean there are other letters of support, as you said. You know. There's quite a few from friends, and I don't know that we have to, you know, put them all into the record.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Well, I'll say this, sir. I counted at least 24-25 letters in your file.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I've got some really -- You know, Mr. -- I've got some really, really good friends. I -- You know, when I was talking earlier about putting myself in the other person's place and learning to always be sensitive to what my actions and how my actions are going to affect other people, it made a profound change in my life. And I've been able to ever since then. Just everything began to change in my life. Although I had some good relationships, long-term relationships, I've been married, as you know, for 21 years.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. I'm going to give you --

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: (Inaudible) --

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Hello, sir.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Can you hear me?

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Yes, I can. But listen. You will receive the opportunity to give a closing statement in a few minutes. Okay?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Okay. I wasn't -- That wasn't a closing statement.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: But you'll be able to discuss why you're suitable for parole.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Okay.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: All right. And you can include that. Is there anything else about parole plans?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: No.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: All right.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Not that I can think of off hand.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. We sent out notices pursuant to Penal Code 3042. We sent those out to different agencies that would have an interest in your case. That includes the District Attorney's office, the Attorney General's office, the presiding judge, law enforcement agencies that had jurisdiction over your case. We do have one response, and we also have the Deputy District Attorney here from Los Angeles who at the appropriate time will have something to say about your suitability for parole. We have a letter here from Frank Merriman, that's M-E-R-R-I-M-A-N, captain, homicide division. And he writes a letter, and he submitted it for our consideration. And I'll read the last three paragraphs. "This was during late 1960, Inmate Beausoleil was a member of the notorious Manson family in connection with whom he tortured and murdered the victim, Mr. Hinman. Members of the family believe Mr. Hinman had valuables concealed in a safe inside his residence belonging to Beausoleil and Susan Atkins to torture --" I'm sorry. "The family believed that Mr. Beausoleil [sic] had valuables concealed in his safe inside his residence, prompting the prisoner and Susan Atkins to torture him to reveal the location of the safe in order to rob him of the contents of it. When they were unsuccessful in obtaining the information, they caught -- they called other family members, including Manson, to assist them. The victim was tortured over a period of two days before the prisoner finally stabbed him in the chest. As the victim was laying -- lied dying, the prisoner and others took turns holding a pillow over the victim's face. The inmate was originally sentenced to death, but upon repeal of capital punishment as it then existed, the sentence was reduced to life in prison. At that time, there was no provision for life in prison without parole. Upon testifying as a defense witness in an unrelated trial in 1993, the inmate matter-of-factually stated that he would return to criminal conduct when released from prison. In a subsequent interview with the late Truman Capote, that's C-A-P-O-T-E, the prisoner declared, don't ever let me out. I will kill again. It is the opinion of this department, that parole of the inmate is inappropriate and should be denied. Frank Merriman, (inaudible)." And that takes care of that. And with that we'll go to questions. And Counselor, I'll give you an opportunity to comment in a few minutes. Commissioner, do you have any questions?

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Yeah, I have a couple for clarification. Mr. Beausoleil, I'm not going to retry you. Okay. So I'm just simply looking at your responses. Why were you packing a nine-millimeter handgun?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: That was given to me by Bruce Davis. It was his gun. I was told that -- This is the reason. When they took me over to Gary Hinman's house, you know, to get the money back from Gary, they put the gun in my hand and told me that I should use it to make sure that he knew that I was serious. I was just -- I was already pretty terrified at this situation with these people, and I just did what they -- I took it with me.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Did you have the --

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I never used a gun before, and, you know, I was just doing what I was told.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Did you have the victim sign over the two pink slips to you prior to murdering him?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: He signed over -- Yes, it was the day before. AS I had said earlier on, this was something he had offered as a way to resolve the conflict that we were having, and this was prior to Charlie showing up and slashing him across the face and all of that. It was, you know, -- This was -- We were balancing out the problem. We wanted to resolve the problem. And at that time, I was ready to leave. And then everything got out of control when Bruce Davis and Charles Manson showed up at the door. But this was -- He was not being forced to sign over anything at this point. He was, you know, -- He no longer -- Nobody was holding a gun on him, trying to make him do it.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Okay. Mr. Beausoleil, did you have the girls write on the wall in blood, political piggy, or -- and the black panther paw?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I did that myself, actually. I had had them help me to clean up the place and to kind of try to make it look like it had been Gary Hinman's cohorts who had killed him.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: And you did that in the victim's blood?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes, Sir, I did.

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: That's all I have.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: District Attorney, do you have any questions?

DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEY DIXON: Just one. The Chair just read in part of Captain Frank Merriman, Sheriff of Homicide letter which quoted a 1993 statement by the defendant while testifying in court that if released, he would return to criminal activity. Would he have a comment on that as of now.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Did you hear the District Attorney's question?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I didn't hear the entire thing, no.

DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEY DIXON: I would like you to comment if you could on the statement made in the letter that the Chair just read in from Captain Frank Merriman, LA Sheriff's Department Homicide, where you testified in court -- I thought I heard it 1993, that if released, you would return to criminal activity. Do you have a comment?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes. Mr. Dixon, I appreciate that you brought that up because I was hoping somebody would. In 1993 I testified. Anyway that is a mistake, and there are a lot of mistakes in that letter in its entirety. I mean there's things that just -- I don't know where that's coming from, maybe some -- one of those bizarre Manson books or something. But it's really weird, and it doesn't -- it's not consistent with the facts of this crime in any stage. This business of, you know, taking turns smothering Gary, Gary was stabbed in the corner. He died from a knife wound to his chest and not from any smothering. There was no -- never anything ever brought up about -- in the court or any other time about looking for a safe. This was basically a little reclusive cabin, a hermit's cabin. There was no safe anywhere. No one would have even imagined anything like this. It's just kind of -- It's one of -- What I was talking about at the very beginning of this hearing, things have gotten really kind of out of control and taken, you know, -- the interpretations on things have really gotten far fetched and away from, you know, any semblance of anything that I recognize. As far as the 19 -- I did testify as a witness. I was supposed to be a character witness in 1973, not 1993. I didn't really volunteer for that. I was called up on stage -- I mean not on stage. I felt like I was on stage. Called on the witness stand to testify regarding the state of mind, why people do the kinds of things that the people that were on trial were accused of doing. And so -- And I, you know, I've got to say that there was -- there were remarks that were made then and there (inaudible) it has been misquoted. Basically, I don't even want to go there. I don't even want to try to explain what's wrong or what's -- I'm just saying that it's not accurate. I will say that when I was young, you know, early 70s -- in the late 60s, early 70s, I had a lot of attitude. I was young. I had a chip on my shoulder. I felt like I was a victim of society. I felt like I was a victim of the bikers. I felt like I was everybody's victim. I blamed everybody but myself. I said a lot of things. I done a lot of things that I'm ashamed of now and that are not representative of who I am or anything about me. They were an expression of teenage (indiscernible) or whatever you want to call it. There was a lot of polarity, as I said earlier, in the country. The country was divided. There was a lot distrust with law enforcement. And I came out of that environment. I don't make any excuses for it. I'm saying that I did say things in a manner of hostility at times, and -- but it is not representative -- It's been three decades since then. It's not representative of who I am now.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. Thank you. District Attorney, any further questions?

DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEY DIXON: No. Thank you.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Did that answer your question?

DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEY DIXON: Yes. Thank you.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. Counselor, do you have any questions for your client?

ATTORNEY HAGIN: Well, I think we've pretty much covered everything. Let me just ask some final, kind of wrap-up questions. And I think you have already clarified this, Bobby. Is it true that you have fully accepted responsibility for your conduct in the offense?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes.

ATTORNEY HAGIN: And how long have you been -- have you accepted responsibility?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I have accepted responsibility probably 25 years ago, roughly, about that is when I finally stopped blaming other people and began to come to terms with it. It's been an ongoing process. It isn't something that happened overnight, and I suddenly had an epiphany and got all better. I mean it had to be something -- It had -- It was something that took a lot of work and a lot of introspection, a lot of counseling. But once I realized that I had to accept responsibility and be accountable for my own actions and that it really all rested with me, I've -- and I've taken every step since then to fully understand the dynamics of my own make up so that I won't ever take a chance on putting myself in a position or a thinking pattern that's going to cause harm to anyone else in any fashion.

ATTORNEY HAGIN: Okay. I need just one other question. At the last hearing, the Board recommended that you explore issues as it relates to your use of narcotics and its involvement in the life crime. How would you incorporate, you know, your recognition of your problems with maybe even marijuana into your release plans?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: I have -- My wife and I have done a little research in the local area, and there is an Alcoholics Anonymous within a bicycle ride from our home. It's at Woodland Chapel in Salem. And my intention is to continue the very effective process that I'm involved in with the Alcoholics Anonymous here at the institution. Now there is a Narcotics Anonymous available here, too, but I find -- I have found that Alcoholics Anonymous is a better developed program. So I've stuck with Alcoholics Anonymous even though I never really had a drinking problem. I found that the dynamic is the same; I mean whether it's marijuana or whether it's alcohol. And the 12 steps do work, and I've found them very valuable. And so I intend to continue that. I'll reiterate what I said earlier. I don't need it. I just -- You know, I don't need pot --

ATTORNEY HAGIN: Okay.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: -- to be happy.

ATTORNEY HAGIN: Okay. Thank you, Bobby. I think that's it. I will have some closing statements, and I think that you may also. I think you've said a lot. But I will save anything further for my closing statement.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. District Attorney, closing.

DEPUTY DISTRICT ATTORNEY DIXON: Thank you. On behalf of the LA DA's office, we would ask the Board to find the inmate unsuitable at this time for a number of reasons. One, the life crime is a very, very serious crime. But what to me is more important in a sense here is that I believe Mr. Beausoleil continues to minimize his involvement in this crime and with the Manson family. For example, just one brief example, he just told this Board that Hinman offered to sign over the pink slips to his car. In reading from the Appellate Court Decision that was filed June -- I think it was the 3rd, 1973, it says here, "When Hinman did not cooperate, the defendant beat him with a gun. Hinman did, upon the defendant's demands, sign the pink slips over to his car." And just the way this crime happened, on the next page, the Appellate Court Decision goes on to state, "DeCarlo testified in substance as follows: Before Hinman's death, he overheard a conversation between Manson and the defendant in which Hinman was called a political pig who should die. After Hinman's death --" Excuse me. "When Gary didn't cooperate, the defendant beat him. Manson came over, cut him with a sword. The defendant stabbed him to death. The defendant told women to wipe down the house for fingerprints." And then later in that page, and this will be the last of it, "Another witness overhead a conversation between the defendant and DeCarlo and some other people at the ranch. The defendant said, in quotes, 'Something about torturing somebody for over seven hours. Something about killing somebody for seven hours because he wouldn't give up.'" That is not the description of this crime that at least I heard before this Board today. It seems to me that's it's important for Mr. Beausoleil to come to grips with exactly what he did and what his involvement with Manson and the family in this crime. Also, in listening to Commissioner Harmon's summary of the number of the psychiatric reports, I don't think the psych reports are really that supportive. It seems to me that Mr. Beausoleil is, I heard, impulsive, has problems with authority, has difficulty in stressful situations, especially when perhaps using some kind of illegal substances. And in '99 he had his most recent problem with that. So at this time, I would urge the Board to find Mr. Beausoleil unsuitable. Thank you.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Thank you, Counselor. Counselor, closing.

ATTORNEY HAGIN: Yes. Let me start by saying that this is my first Parole Board hearing, much less lifer hearing. And I understand from talking to lawyers who do these hearings, who have had a lot of experience doing them, that it is only in exceptional cases that parole is granted. What I submit to you is that Bobby Beausoleil is that exception. The strives that he has made within the confines of the system are truly remarkable. I can't imagine, and maybe I'm wrong, but I can't imagine that it's common for somebody who is sentenced to life behind bars to come before you after giving back so much to society in attempts to make amends for their wrongdoing as has Bobby Beausoleil. I'm sure that not many prisoners are developing videos for at-risk youth to keep youth out of prison as Bobby Beausoleil does, has done, continues to do. I'm sure that not many prisoners have been on the board of directors of youth crime prevention programs, help kids stay out of gangs as Bobby does. I'm especially sure that not many people in Bobby's position have remained -- He's been in custody for 34 years, have remained in healthy loving marriages for over 21 years to upstanding citizens as Bobby has done. I can't imagine that people in his position have professional job offers in multiple states from multiple companies and individuals awaiting them, and this number of glowing letters of support from children who barely know him, siblings who he maintains relationships with. I may be surprised, but I think that this is probably an exceptional case. There is no question that Bobby has accepted full responsibility for his conduct. We have submitted the statement of facts to you today, and Bobby accepts absolutely full responsibility for associating with someone, and that person is Charlie Manson, who was a terrible person. He accepts full responsibility for stabbing this person. He accepts full responsibility for this crazy time in his life when he was a completely different person than he is now. The other things that have entered the record, these things about -- first of all, that he was, you know, a member of the family. You know. I've read Helter Skelter and Charlie Manson; those things say he's actually a member of the Manson family. Whatever. That's neither here nor there. Torture, I don't -- From what I've seen in the record and from what, you know, Bobby has maintained the entire time, I don't see that there was torture conducted. What I do know is that he has come to terms with the crime. He has -- He understands how and why he took part in the crime. And the fact is that he would not be as successful at the work he does now, which is video production, if he didn't really comprehend his actions and his deficiencies which led to the crime. If he didn't have this understanding, he wouldn't be able to translate his mistakes into these videos to forewarn youth from really keeping out of the system. And he successfully does that. There's a letter that I submitted from Nancy LaPage. She says, Bobby Beausoleil kept my son out of gangs, out of prison. He has done everything in his power to rehabilitate, and he has been successful at doing that. What is most important, I think, is that he has followed each and every one of the Board's recommendations. I've looked back at all of the past decisions, and what stands out to me is that at each and every -- after each and every decision, he takes very seriously the recommendations the Board has made. He now, from what I can see, is in the best position he's ever been in for release. He has no new discipline. He's continued self-help and programming. He's continued AA. He has credible parole plans. Even the psychologist -- And I disagree with Mr. Dixon. Even the psychologist who most recently evaluated him says that he is now, quote, "in remission." I don't know how you can really get any better than that. He is a model prisoner. He has support on the outside. There is no question in my mind, and even more importantly in Bobby Beausoleil's mind, that he would continue to be an asset to the community on his release. I'll end it by saying he has served 34 or maybe 35 years in prison for his wrongdoing. He is ready to transition. He can do this. He will be successful. I ask that he be given that opportunity.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Thank you, Counsel. Mr. Beausoleil, --

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Thank you.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: -- would you like to make a closing statement, or you can let your attorney's statement be your closing statement.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Yes, I would. I would like to make a statement and say a few things. Now this is the part where I get to tell you why I think you ought to let me out of prison. And you know, that's not really what I understand about what is happening and that was really happening, because this really is not about me. I understand that now, whereas I didn't when I was a kid, you know, when I was 20 or 21 years old. I thought it was all about me. But it's not about me. This is about what is best for society. I hope that what is best for society and what I can bring to a successful parole will coincide at some point. I do want to be united with my family, but like I said, it's not really about what I want. But for what it's worth, I'm going to tell you what I want. What I want is to be able to no longer be considered a liability. I want to be considered an asset. I am fully capable of doing that. I have abilities and talents that I worked very hard to develop, that I've learned how to use in a way that's beneficial to a lot of people, both in this community on the inside and to the outside community. I'd like to be able to do this more effectively. So if it's about what I want, that's what I want to be able to do. But again, it's not really about what I want. It's about what is best for society. And in that regard, I'll say this. I am really extremely sorry for what I've done to bring harm to all the people that I've brought harm to over the years. And it begins, of course, with Gary. And I am fully cognizant of what I did there. I mean there's discrepancies in the facts, and I really can't speak to that anymore. I've told you what I know from my own experience, and I hope that you will use that to mitigate Danny DeCarlo's self-serving statements early on. It's my own fault that I didn't own up early on and have this be part of the actual court records. So I have nobody to blame there. And so I can't really tell you that you have to believe me. All I can do is represent to the best of my ability the facts as I know them. I killed Gary Hinman. I am responsible for that. It was my decision to do it. Nobody forced me or ordered me to do it. I feel that I was, you know, as I've said, I was kind of forced into the position of being there in the first place, but that, again, was from the decisions that I had made earlier on. I had entered into a drug transaction that escalated and got out of control. But I made that decision initially, and it rests with me. I must hold myself accountable. Insofar as how it has hurt Gary, in 1981, a man did exactly to me what I did to him. I was stabbed in the heart and both lungs, and for some reason, some miracle kept me alive. And so now I since then for the past 22 years, I've had an opportunity to remember what that felt like. So I know what I did. I also know how it affected Gary's family because I know intimately how it affected mine. Excuse me. I hurt a lot of people, and I'm very sorry for having done that. I want to be able to give something back. It is my very clear intention to give something back, to do the best that I can to make amends, to honor Gary's life by helping other people to understand how I took it, so that they won't make the same mistakes that I've made. I think that's probably the best that I can give, although I know it's never really enough. If all I have is a prison cell and a piece of paper and a pencil, I will continue that work. Thank you.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. Thank you for your comments, sir. We'll take a recess and let you know our decision. Don't hang up. We're going to put you on hold. Okay?

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Okay.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: It's going to be a little while.

RECESS

CALIFORNIA BOARD OF PAROLE HEARINGS DECISION

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Everyone in the room have returned with the exception of the two observers from the Department of Correction. And they have since gone back to their duty -- assignment. However, we do have another person in the room. Would you identify yourself.

MS. LEON: Jade Leon, case records analyst for SACCO unit.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Could you repeat that, Sir? I didn't hear it.

MS. LEON: Jade Leon. I'm with the Region I SACCO unit. I'm a case records analyst.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Okay.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay. And she's the one that hooks up the teleconference --

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Oh, I see.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: -- material -- equipment, I should say. Anyways, sir, we do have a decision. The Panel reviewed all the information received from the public and relied on the following circumstances in concluding that the prisoner is not suitable for parole and would pose an unreasonable risk of danger to society or a threat to public safety if released from prison. And one of the reasons is the offense was carried out in an especially cruel and callous manner. The offense was carried out in a dispassionate or calculated manner. And we would conclude that it was carried out in an execution style murder. We certainly feel that the victim was abused. We feel that the victim was mutilated. And it is the opinion of this Panel that the victim was tortured before he was killed. And that's based on the cuts that he received and lack of any medical attention. The offense was carried out in a manner that demonstrates an exceptionally callous disregard for another human being, and the motive for the crime was inexplicable or very trivial in relationship to the offense. The conclusion was drawn from the Statement of Facts wherein the prisoner was convicted of the murder of Mr. Hinman, H-I-N-M-A-N. And the circumstances surrounding this is that -- the crime is that the prisoner thrust a knife into his chest, and basically he executed the victim after the victim had been in his custody, sort of speak, for a period of time. Then he took his car, and he was arrested in San Luis Obispo with the victim's car. And the crime also talks about his relationship with the Manson family and the role that played in the killing of the victim. The prisoner did not have a major criminal history. However, he did have some contact with law enforcement agencies. Those contacts was basically Health and Safety violations, marijuana -- possession of marijuana. However, he was not convicted of any of those crimes. And the only crime that he was convicted of was a leash law. Under unstable social history, the Board was not really at this time able to really establish that the prisoner had an unstable social history. The prisoner has programmed since his last hearing in an acceptable manner, no disciplinaries. Recent psychiatric report shows that the prisoner have made some progress in terms of his level of dangerousness both in and out of a controlled environment. The prisoner does have realistic parole plans, have lots of support letters, several job offers. Very impressive parole plans. The Hearing Panel notes that in response to Penal Code 3042 notices indicate an opposition to a finding of suitability, that the Deputy District Attorney from Los Angeles spoke in opposition of a finding of suitability. And there was a letter in the file from the sheriff's department in Los Angeles speaking in strong opposition of a finding of suitability. The Panel makes the following findings: The prisoner needs to continue to involve himself in positive programs, the kind of programs that would help him be able to face, understand, and cope with stressful situations in a nondestructive manner. Until enough progress is made, the prisoner continues to be unpredictable and a threat to others. The prisoner's gains are recent. He must demonstrate an ability to maintain these gains over an extended period of time. I'm talking about the substance abuse -- the recent substance abuse, I think as recent as 1999. Nevertheless, there is some things that we want to commend the prisoner for. I've already articulated the fact that his counselor -- his attorney did an impressive job of putting together a brief and the support letters and support from different lives in the community, from family and friends. And also the prisoner have what appears to be bonafide job offers from people that believe in him, believe that he is suitable for parole. And also there's letters in the file from the prison, from the institution in Oregon where the activity coordinator -- and I believe there was one in there from a captain speaking about how the prisoner have made significant contributions to the prison there in Oregon with his video expertise, making videos. So certainly, we want to commend him for that effort and want to encourage him to continue in that mode. However, those positive aspects of his behavior does not outweigh the factors of unsuitability. Parole is going to be denied for two years. In a separate decision, the Hearing Panel finds that it is not reasonable to expect that parole would be granted at a hearing during the following two years. The specific reasons, one, the crime. The crime was committed in an especially cruel and callous manner. The prisoner after the victim was held, after he was cut, the prisoner thrust a knife into his chest, killing the victim. The offense was carried out in a manner that demonstrates an exceptionally callous disregard for another human being, and the motive for the crime was inexplicable, at the very least, very trivial in relationship to the offense that was committed. Recent psychiatric report shows that the prisoner has made some progress since his last hearing. However, there's still room for improvement. The prisoner has not completed necessary programming which is essential to his adjustment and needs additional time to gain such programming. Therefore, a longer period of observation and evaluation of the prisoner is required before the Board shall find that the prisoner is suitable for parole. The Panel recommends that the prisoner remain disciplinary-free, that he continue to involve himself in positive kinds of self-help programs. Commissioner, do you have any comments?

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Nothing further.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: That concludes this hearing at approximately 1430. Good luck to you, sir.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Thank you.

ATTORNEY HAGIN: I have just a couple of questions. I don't know if I'm permitted to ask a couple of questions after your decision.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Okay.

ATTORNEY HAGIN: And that is, you know, you mentioned that he should continue, you know, programming. I'm wondering specifically, you know, in the next two years if there's anything that you can recommend that he could do to --

[Thereupon, the tape was changed.]

DEPUTY COMMISSIONER HARMON: Okay. Go ahead.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: One and foremost is that the prisoner should not get any more disciplinaries, especially the ones that deal with substance abuse. We certainly recommend that he participate -- continue to participate in substance abuse programs, and that he makes substance abuse a part of his parole plans -- substance abuse prevention is what I'm trying to say, a part of his programming. That should be an extension of his program. Also I, like the District Attorney, had some very -- had some concerns about the prisoner's version of the crime, or his different versions of the crime over the years. However, it appears that the prisoner is trying to take responsibility for the crimes that he committed. But I certainly had some concerns about that. But overall, I certainly recommend that he continue to program in a positive manner, and that he not get any more 115s, and that he certainly involve himself in substance abuse and other types of positive self-help programs. Okay.

ATTORNEY HAGIN: Okay. Thank you.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: Thank you. That concludes this hearing. Good luck to you, Mr. Beausoleil.

INMATE BEAUSOLEIL: Thank you.

PRESIDING COMMISSIONER WELCH: That concludes this hearing at approximately 1430.

--oOo--

PAROLE DENIED TWO YEARS